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Tuesday, July 5, 2016

Why Damian Wayne Gets So much HATE


Damian Wayne is a character that many readers love or they hate. Me, I can’t stand him.


As I see it the whole concept behind Damian Wayne is fine in a DC Elseworld as Robin. But he just doesn’t fit organically in the main DC Universe.


Ever since his introduction, Damian Wayne hasn’t meshed well into the Batman mythology. Like the resurrected Jason Todd, he just feels awkward and out of place. Throwing the entire Legend of Batman out of sync.


Why? The whole concept of a superhero sidekick is designed so that the reader can participate in the adventure. Sidekicks are supposed to be everykids that readers can identify with and relate to. When the sidekick has no biological connection to the hero like Dick Grayson, or Tim Drake, readers can see themselves in the role of being at Batman’s side.


However, when a biological familial relationship is established, the reader’s personal connection to the hero is severed. It’s hard for a reader to see himself or herself as Robin when he has a biological son. And they can’t see themselves in the role of being Batman’s sidekick when there’s a son there in their place.


The main reason why so many comic fans hate Damian Wayne is because he’s taking their place in Batman’s adventures. Many comic fans feel like they’re being replaced in Batman’s stories and that he’s getting all the attention they want to get from their favorite hero.


And they hate him even more because he acts like a pretentious snit. Like Wesley Crusher before him, Damian Wayne is the Gary Stu who knows everything and can do anything. It’s really hard to enjoy a Batman comic when a 10-year-old can do everything Batman can do.


With Dick Grayson and Tim Drake readers saw these characters learn from Batman. And as they grew into their roles as heroes, readers grew with them on their journeys. Damian Wayne robs readers of that growing and learning experience. He prevents them from being a part of the adventure and sharing in the fun of being Batman’s sidekick.  


This is why many readers hate him.


From a business perspective, when a character is 50/50 with readers, meaning half love him and half hate them, it’s time to get rid of them and move on. Because that means half the readers who would buy a characters’ adventures are buying comics and the other half are staying home. Sure Batman sells 100,000 copies. But he could’ve sold 250,000 copies if they got rid of this character once and for all.



The way I see it, Batman doesn’t need a son. What he needs is a writer who can focus on creating a more balanced vision of the Dark Knight for the 21st Century. Damian Wayne is systemic of a big problem with the Batman Mythos where the heroes have become ciphers for readers instead of their own characters.  

29 comments:

  1. Good point Shawn. Damian is definitely the Poochie of the DC Universe. He's not just Robin, he's Robin to the EXTREME! But I'm a little surprised that they let Batman even have a son, given how ageist DC comics is now-a-days. By giving Batman a son that almost immediately ages the character. So instead of being a guy in his early 30s, now with a 10 year old son Batman is like a guy in his 40s. Just more of DC not really thinking things, through.

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    1. Just give it a few years. Many characters will be middle aged or older with kids in the DCU, all thanks to Batman’s lead. I don't agree with it, but that is the direction I see DC going. I don't know what the author of this blog thinks about having all the superheroes aging, but I think old superheroes with kids and grandkids belong in Elseworlds.

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    2. And this is my big beef with Marvel/DC right now, they feel the need to go into every aspect of a character's life, they do not feel the need to leave aspects to the imagination. I wouldn't put it beyond some comic book publisher to make a superhero have a child in continuity just to end up making the child a mary sue and a brat, like Damian Wayne is. From a historical standpoint, Batman sold far more comic books years ago than he used to. Superman sold way more comic books years ago than he used to. It honestly has not felt like a geniune Superman to me since before Crisis on Infinite Earths, moments like the Muhammad Ali match were interesting, after COIE, good character moments in continuity were few and far between. Batman? well, now he has a brat that gets dibs over the other people in the Batman cast because he is Batman's son. He has treated the other people in Batman's supporting cast like shit. I say this because this was every bit the choice of higher ups to write this character in, and make him like this. It was also a big shaft to the idea of Batman romancing Catwoman, because they decided to make Batman an idiot so that Talia Al Ghul could rape him and conceive Damian Wayne that way. Batman, Superman, and the other big DC Characters have been turned into punks, and it is sad to see that for me. The true heroes for me were from before Crisis on Infinite Earths, with some honorable mentions a little of the way into the 1990s.

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  2. I don't get what's so appealing about Tim Drake since I dislike him. (I don't care about Damian to know whether to like or hate him.) I think he's annoying and obnoxious and I still don't get the appeal.

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    1. Ad, Tim is a cool character. He came out of the Batman Mythos organically and fit right in the DCU. He carried his own comic was a founding member of Young Justice, and formed a great friendship with Kon-El AKA Superboy. and Impulse Bart allen. He was the kid many grew up with and made us all understand why Batman needs a Robin.

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    2. Tim Drake's a pest and he's about as natuarlised as a rabbit in Australia. He's also emo crap.

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  3. Damian was dug up from a 90s Elseworld at the same time Selina was made pregnant by another man SPECIFICALLY to tell a portion of the fandom that liked the Bat/Cat pairing to fuck off and go away. That's why DC's refusal to eliminate him in reboot after reboot is taken as a continued middle finger extended to those readers, and why they will never, ever accept any reboot that claims to make things right that doesn't include his removal so that he never existed, and admits his off-page purpose so he can never exist without their admitting their malice against those fans.

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    1. I wish Damian would just go away. He is a terrible character who sucks the life out of comics.

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    2. I hated it for that so very much, I think Bruce and Selina work very well together, not to mention the gender rape double-standard involved in how Damian came to be. I don't care if the character is man or woman in a comic book, I absolutely hate it when they make a character in comic books get raped. I mean, weren't these comic books meant for 12 year olds once upon a time. Which is why I only really like the Bronze Age DC and Marvel, they aren't into all this mature BS.

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    3. You need to check your facts and figures. In 2009 you might have been accurate but in 2018 Damian is easily the 3rd most popular and profitable Member of the family behind Bruce and Dick. Heck his solo outsold Tim's Red Robin series and Jason has never come close to his numbers ever.
      His animated movie even out performed the animated Dark Knight movies

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    4. But Damian hasn't outsold Tim Drake's solo series from the 1990's that went over 150 issues. Tim Drake's Robin was a merchandising machine on a level of Dick Grayson with multiple action figures, video game appearances and T-Shirts. Damian is nowhere near that level or ever will be on that level.

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    5. Of course Tim's solo ran for a while. The family had like four members and he was Robin for close if not over 40 years.
      Damian has been around 10 years 18 months of that dead and he out sold Tim's RR. Give the him 30 odd years and then compare.
      Can current Tim match the Old 80's robin issues that he set when he had less competition?

      Dude can barely get on a page .
      Also Tim from the animated series was Jason with Tim's name [the creators wanted Jason because they liked his personality and found him interesting but they were made to call him Tim to match the comic Robin at the time]slapped on the only time Tim has ever appeared in outside media as himself was in YJ season 2.
      It's almost like DC knows hes about a blander than ice cubes.

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    6. The only reason I got any movie that had Damian in it was because it was supposed to be a Batman movie AND I was seriously hoping Nightwing would be in it. The ONLY reason I buy the movies and shows is because I think Dick Grayson might be in it. Personally, I can't stand Damian. He's obnoxious, rude, arrogant, disrespectful, hateful, excessively violent for violence's sake. I really can't stand watching a snot-nosed brat being made an equal to or better than an adult or his parent. I don't care how good he might be - no 10 yr old can take on an adult (particularly one trained like Batman, Nightwing, or Deathstroke) and come out on top without a definite cheat taking place - in this case, on the part of the writers. It may not be popular to the kiddies, but physically, a 10 yr old doesn't have the reach, the muscle strength, the weight, or the experience that an adult has. The BS that says Damian's been training since he was born is ridiculous as it is stupid. It takes several years for even a precocious child to develop the dexterity, strength, agility, and speed to begin training properly. Damian wouldn't have begun receiving real training until he was 4 but I'd say 6 years old. Meaning that Damian only had between 4 and 6 years of serious training and he's supposed to be superior to adults who have been training for decades - his father who has trained himself in mind and body to be the pinnacle of human perfection. I don't buy it. I won't even go into the emotional upheavals of puberty that would easily ruin most of Damian's strategic endeavors. He might have had it rough, been abused, but this would make him MORE of a liability and a wild-card than an asset.

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  4. I agree Shawn, as a matter of fact, the early 2000s was the time I walked away from the unipublisher that is Marvel/DC, it all became convoluted as hell for both, and both are in a reboot/relaunch cycle where a number of characters hardly grow at all. At this point, I only really buy Indie comics and watch the superhero movies. I guess I just grew out of it. A lot of these comics are not for a casual buyer like me either, many of them require collecting so many, and are not standalone in nature. I wish that comics would be like the animated shows done by Bruce Timm/Paul Dini or Dawyne McDuffie. Either way, like what you had to write.

    Cheers,

    John

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  5. Well, that's your opinion, personally, I love the character C:

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  6. Well, I had a long comment prepared and then I clicked away and it's gone now. Great.

    Anyway, briefly: Your "business perspective" is dubious.

    1. Most fans, right or wrong, do enjoy Damian. Yes, he has sizable hatedom, but so does Batman.

    2. By your logic, Green Arrow, who's series is currently outselling majority of Marvel's output, should be destroyed and forgotten long ago. It doesn't just matter how many people love vs how many people hate, what also matters is the amount of people who care one way or the other to begin with.

    3. I hope your Batman example was hypothetical and you seriously don't think any significant number of Batman readers would drop it because Damian shows up here and there.

    You are of course entitled to hate the character and don't take as saying there is something wrong with it.

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  7. Wow. Last year old post, but while I liked your analysis I must say that the robin character is not necessary the readers lenses into Batman world, yet Robin was especially created to make Batman comics more lighthearted and yes, stupid Damian adds a horrible baggage to the mythos, that many fans dislike. While I don't "hate" a fictional person as is nonsensical hating something that doesn't exist I can understand Grant Morrison's wanting to explore this character when he added the dynamic of Dick Grayson and Damian.

    Yet as you mentioned it should has been treated as an Elsesworlds storline instead of forcing readers to "accept" the character as a main one. My dislike for Damian is not so much as he is a prick than the fact that it has changed Batman dynamic in the comics.

    I just can't picture Batman as a father figure, he is a dark lonely character, in a detective mystery drama setting. Batman is never going to be a happy character (not like the 60's version doesn't really count) is like making a happily ever after Darth Vader with his wife and kids, or making the Punisher find happiness and a retired life, or name "your favortie tragic character here" it just doesn't work.

    Damian Wayne takes the "son" and the "Robin" mantra as he if is entitled to it and away from the other Robins the way he is presented to us. As if being the son of Batman makes him the most important Robin in history, it kinda sends a bad message to the readers.

    If Batman is seen as a father figure then it really makes his relationship with the other Robins something as that he never really cared for them in all his years together.

    If Dick, Jason, and Tim are his "adopted sons" why suddenly having a "blood son" is more important? Is sending this kind of message that an adoptive family is less valid than your "blood relatives" which is not nessesary true. What is this saying to readers that have adoptive fathers and mothers?.

    Until the new 52 I never seen Batman being a "father" to any of his Robins the same way he is represented with Damian in his run in Batman and Robin for example, written by Tomasi.
    After Morrison, writers have tried to "tone down" the Damian character, yet to me the damage this character has made is already done, I don't care how many "redemption arcs" he is given, how many human qualities or likable traits or whatever is placed on him by writers or readers.

    He still this character that adds a level of stupid baggage, unnecessary angst and sentimentality to Batman that has ruined the comics for me and many other fans. I don't want to read "Batman the father years" I want to read mystery, action, drama and a good detective story.

    If I wanted a really good family drama I go watch Star Wars again. That's not what I want when I picture Batman in the darkness of Gotham City. Batman is aloof, lonely with emotional and mental issues, who has taken under his wing the same kind of lonley people, (yes I'm aware Damian too) but this entitle little brat, adds this nonsense father son dynamic, that I just simply can't stand. Batman is not a father figure, period.

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  8. By your logic Twilight should not be the hit it currently is because Bella Swan, Edward Cullen, and Jacob Black have nothing to offer the reader and should have tanked. Maybe the audiences idea of depth is weak. Yet Damian has shown to be a deep character one that many can relate to in regards to his originally weak social skills. I know I can because of what I am and he has actually found some place in the DC Universe.

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  9. And actually there are flaws in the Robin concept number one of which is the idea that kids relate to to Dick and Tim because they grow and learn by being his sidekick. I think the truth is most people kids included would rather be Batman than his sidekick.

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  10. i Love Damaian and Jason. Damian has outsold IN SUPERSONS:

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  11. Tim Drake is a mary sue. "he never has flaws." I can’t stand him.

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  12. Tim Drake is the lease liked Robin/ bat member in the DC. I-hated Drake since he became red robin his unhealthy obssesion with Bruce made me sick. He's ALWAYS bitchin'. He bitched to become Robin...He bitched when Jason came back to life...He bitched when he thought Jason killed Dula Dent...He bitched when Jason was Batman...He bitched when Jason wanted to kill the person who stole his Red Robin costume the first time...And he bitched EVERY time Jason kicked his ass. Damian SALES .

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  13. Damian Wayne already beat him up. He may not had won the fight to others, but if a 10 year old does that much damage to ANYteenager in a fight...The 10 year old won.Fans of Tim's make it even easier to hate him because of the stupidity they bring to arguments about him.

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  14. Tim fanBOYS..always tryin' to throw away the facts when Tim'sells like shit.

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  15. Tim lost. Because a 10 year old was STILL givin' him problems in a fight. And Damian wasn't the only 10 year old that beat Tim.

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  16. I stopped reading when you said your opinions are facts.And the OP has some severe Damian issues.

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  17. This is why many readers hate him,?? I laughed so hard, I think I cracked a rib.
    i love Damian . Tim Drake stans are so 90S. Tim Drake is the weakest of the Batman fam....

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  18. Tim Drake is the ultimate Fanboy Mary Sue.

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  19. Damian Wayne is so lacking in depth and humility that any random fanboy or fangirl could have created his character (and probably already did long before he showed up in comics). He just turned up infused with nearly ALL of Batman's traits and skills without any believable means of (or deep personal motive for) aquiring them. He's not his own person, he's a little snotty Bruce Wayne clone with no unique personality, drive, or likeable traits of his own. Having a pet cow (lame) doesnt excuse being the Richie Rich douchebag of the DC-verse. He may as well be Lex Luthor's brat acting like that. Damian's a jerk to his adoptive family (something a believably written Bruce Wayne wouldn't put up with because the Bat Family's basically all he has - most hand picked even - and he didn't go through Hell becoming Batman when his parents were killed in front of him just to stand aside and let some little shit one of his femme fatale flings grew in an artificial womb - cause she couldn't be bothered to carry the kid herself [some 'love' child] - waltz in and treat the Bat Family like crap). I'm not even the Bat/Cat fan I used to be but admittedly it would've been much more believable for a 'canon' kid of Batman's to be mothered by Selina instead of Talia (cute and ruthless but still daddy's puppet at heart). Parentage aside, if the writers just HAD to give Batman a biological son they could've done so much better than Damian. It's like they didn't even try that hard. I'm hoping in a few years some true-to-character writers will come along and kill off that mistake. Then maybe we'll get back to the -real- Batman adventures and quit trying to make the Dark Knight into some kind of hypocritic socker dad. Kinda sad that Mary Sues and Gary Stus are being passed off as main characters now. I guess writers really won't work any harder than the audience requires them to.

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